Is anybody interisted in a 411 ecu swap?

[Tinbender59]

Hello all; since I broke new ground with my Vortec distributor LT1 mod "now running TPI on the LT1". I was approched by another member about the posability of modding an opti for the same purpose. Well we are getting close friends, I have identified the sensor that I will use,and the basic direction of the mod, and I can use my truck to prove the concept once it is finished, with out risking being stranded. here is the curent thread on it when I remove the first screw I'll start posting it on this thread as well for your enjoyment lol

oops forgot something http://ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt4-modifications/1648624-reluctor-fabrication.html

[popo8]

subscribed.

LTXtech.com is my drug.

[Mystery Bird]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[ZOHAN]

Hmm

Making you silky smooth...

[Tinbender59]

ordered the sensors today, first up will be to create a new disk, good thing I got a Plazma torch :cool:

[Sahara54]

I'm in for this too...

[firebird_1995]

Do you need a file written? I have a guy that cnc plasma cut my supercharger brackets. I wrote the file and he cut it.

[Tinbender59]

Do you need a file written? I have a guy that cnc plasma cut my supercharger brackets. I wrote the file and he cut it.

Ah ha i was hopeing someone would show up :cool: when I get it WORKING ???? I could use a method of "mass" producing them. and you may get the tap LOL thank you Mr Bird for the info. oh no :face_shocked: i just saw your nick name, what do you get when a "fabricator and a tinbender get together ------- A frigin mess of failed ideas all over the floor. LOL

[firebird_1995]

LOL that name was given to me by popo, I wouldn't call myself a fabricator... more of a tinkerer. And yes I have many a failed and deserted projects strewn about all over my garage. Its a blessing and a curse! BTW were you a sheetmetal worker by chance? We call the tinners "tinbenders" at work.

[popo8]

U DONT give itself enuf credit man...

Just an LTXtech addict

[Tinbender59]

LOL that name was given to me by popo, I wouldn't call myself a fabricator... more of a tinkerer. And yes I have many a failed and deserted projects strewn about all over my garage. Its a blessing and a curse! BTW were you a sheetmetal worker by chance? We call the tinners "tinbenders" at work.

oh ya!! back in the day, I was the Leadman in a fabration shop - worked my way up. that was where I built my first 3 cab extensions (Firetrucks). With Ol Betsy - the break press, and Suzzy - the shear. I could work magic, LOL them were the days. and I have a natural knack with all things metal, that is where I came up with the name. I sure wish I could afford a shear and break press for my play house


here is a 1953 Willies Pickup extension I built http://www.flickr.com/photos/tinbender59/3133142759/

[Tinbender59]

Ha Ha sensors arrived today, woho!! ok I'm going to level with you all. I am torn between making this public info or trying to get a patent on it. There is 2 problems with the patent idea, first is cost, second is big corp's with croooooked lawers. so common sense says just put it out there??? I am thinking if I mod an opti it will be around $200 +/- exchange. sensor is $50, disk custom built $40+/- then welding time and materials?? any thoughts out there. tomorrow I will have it in the house (warmer) to start the "real world" work.

[firebird_1995]

Get a working prototype first. Our little platform doesn't have a huge following so I don't think there's a huge risk in showing your cards. Once you get it working you can base the amount of buzz it generates on whether its worth reproducing.

[sleepy_z]

Subscribed!

[Tinbender59]

Get a working prototype first. Our little platform doesn't have a huge following so I don't think there's a huge risk in showing your cards. Once you get it working you can base the amount of buzz it generates on whether its worth reproducing.

that is where common sence kind of hit me in the face.I'll probably be the only fool doing the mod so it shouldn't be an issue. :doh: lol:jest:

[firebird_1995]

It shouldn't, but at the same time I'm sure there will be enough people interested that you will be able to sell a few and everyone wins

[Tinbender59]

It shouldn't, but at the same time I'm sure there will be enough people interested that you will be able to sell a few and everyone wins

that is what i'm thinking, as I said I hope to start the process tomorrow, at least tear down the opti and get a look at the new sensor and hope I'm right. lol

[Tinbender59]

27341first mock up, the disk is a little bit big, and I have to build a mount for the sensor.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/tinbender59/12797555294/

I'll get it cleaned up and better pictures as we build. I have talked to one of the members about writing a program for cutting the disks and possably contacting his source to MFG them for us.

[Tinbender59]

Blast it anyway, the sensor I purchased has a max temp of 185f. THAT aint gonna work!!!! so back to the resarch. Not to worry, ------ um ------ maybe??? I have found a possablility though, stay tuned. Ol Murphy just had to show up LOL

[Tinbender59]

hi everybody, this is a long way from being over. lol I just have to run scenerios in my pea brain, pick my advisors brains, in order to weed out MOST of the bad ideas, and hopefully find the good ones. As i have stated before I am a board level trained electronics tech, as such I have a theory about the 411, but I need a schematic of the circuite board inside of it. or I will just have to open one up and see if I can decipher it the hard way. if I am corect, this is a done deal. but my track record is some what lacking on this project. but heck, If it were easy efi would have done it this way. EFI I do have the utmost respect for your work in the pionering of the 411, just looking for a cheaper way to do this part.

[Tinbender59]

alrighty then; i picked up a 411 today opened it up and as I suspected. I can mod it to take 5vdc on the cam sensor input, so the 5vdc sensor that I found will work. we are still in the race on this stay tuned. I will put this mod out for everyone to do themselves. If I do it, the cost of the complete mod would get close to the other guys cost and defeet my idea lol


P.S. I am picking the 411's up for $42.xx here

[Tinbender59]

new thought

I really am stupid. close off 4 of the 6 low resolution windows, use 2 of them 180 degrees out from each other and use a $2 J/K FlipFlop to switch between hi / low, output to a $10 SCR, frickin simple "several explicit words basicly calling myself a great big moron"" again!!!!




but what if it got lost ??? hum???

ok use 360 windows to give the 2X count, then close off all but 1 window on the low res to reset the counter at crank "0", to high or low state which ever is needed for 1st crank rotation.

any input??

I think I may still go forward with the other system for now, as I think that most want to get away from the OPTI part ???? it is the weak link in the system. an if needed I can use the SCR to step the 5vdc up to 12vdc, which may be the best plan yet, an quit jackin with the 411. sorry "thinking out loud again"

[Injuneer]

Hopefully you will close off 6 of the 8 low res windows to get 2 windows 180* apart. :D

Four of the slots are unique lengths - #8 = 7*, #3 = 12*, #5 = 17*, #2 = 22*. Couldn't you count the number of high res pulses that occur on each low res window to identify the specific cylinder. Then it wouldn't get lost.

[Tinbender59]

Hopefully you will close off 6 of the 8 low res windows to get 2 windows 180* apart. :D

Four of the slots are unique lengths - #8 = 7*, #3 = 12*, #5 = 17*, #2 = 22*. Couldn't you count the number of high res pulses that occur on each low res window to identify the specific cylinder. Then it wouldn't get lost.


good thought but that would require a processor to "think" out the issue.

[Tinbender59]

the current hold up is the designer, wating on prints and stuff to send to the machine shop. this is not dead yet, stay tuned

[Tinbender59]

talked to my designer, I should have the drawings by friday, then I can contact a machine shop to cut out a couple of prototypes "disks" , and on to the mod and assembly of the optiless opti :usa: hopefully within 30 days - depending on cost of prototypes.

[firebird_1995]

You've got mail partner. Drawings are done.

[Toronto_LT1]

Subscribed.

[Tinbender59]

You've got mail partner. Drawings are done.

cool we have the new reluctor designed, now to find a cutter, moving forward with this :cheers:

[Tinbender59]

good news guys, I found a cutter, water jet. when I place an order of 500 units the final cost will be under $15 for the reluctor, now I need to finish working out how to interface it to the 411 wont be to hard ----- ?????

[firebird_1995]

Oh wow! I just sent you an email with the contact info of the guy that did my brackets. That's a good price per unit but this guy will do piece work.

[Tinbender59]

Oh wow! I just sent you an email with the contact info of the guy that did my brackets. That's a good price per unit but this guy will do piece work.


cool, It is costing me $100 for the prototypes a litle harsh, but safer.

[Tinbender59]

finaly have a name for it MAGNA-SPARK !!! ???? THOUGHTS ?????

[bigtoyz]

2 thumbs up there:claps:

[superspirit]

That works !

[Tinbender59]

It will have a magnetic sensor instead of an optical, so it seemed to be the logical name change :cool: lol

[Featherburner]

finaly have a name for it MAGNA-SPARK !!! ???? THOUGHTS ?????Already used. http://www.cbperformance.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=2014

[Tinbender59]

Already used. http://www.cbperformance.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=2014

you are not my friend!! lol Dang it:embarassed: gotta find a new name, :argue:

[Tinbender59]

Magnatronix??? Magnatron???

[popo8]

How about just " MAG ?"



LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[superspirit]

Actually if you leave the hyphen in the name, you should be OK. but you should consult an official source on that.

[Ccreddell]

How bout "TinMade".

[popo8]

"mag-tin"

LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[Ccreddell]

Rin Tin Tin, its a real dog.....

[MoeHorsePower]

Rin Tin Tin, its a real dog.....

And Bingo was His name o....

[Tinbender59]

ah ha ha ha funny boys!! funny boys!!

tomorrow I'll be heading to the cutter to get the proto type cut!!

[Tinbender59]

I should Have the new reluctor in my hands Monday, just before I come to work. the next step will be prepping the truck to be a test mule. May put the new cam in at the same time??? once the truck is ready, build the modded distributor, then get the timming of the reluctor worked out. once I have the timming worked out get a new prototype made and test it. this will be a little slow for a while, but we are gaining momentum.

[Tinbender59]

I now have the proto-type reluctor in my pocket. I will be playing with it this weekend. as soon as firebird_1995 (http://ltxtech.com/forums/member.php?4287-firebird_1995) has the Water pump spacers figured out, I will get a set of them made. then get the system on my truck for testing.

[superspirit]

sounds like a plan.

[Tinbender59]

I don't know about any body else, but I'm Pumped!!!

[popo8]

Very excited as well. Anything that van keep the LT alive just a lil longer... makes popo happy

LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[Tinbender59]

I am pumped today!!! I had to hand mill the Opti housing, but it is assembled, need to do a little final tuning, but mechanicly it works!!! spins free with good clearence, waiting on the electronics components so that I can let the smoke out of them (burn them up) lol. once the electronics are ~working~ ? I will get it on the truck for testing. I am going to be going back to the dyno for a retune, so I will wait until this is on the truck and proven to run, then test it on the dyno as well. Isn't it cool how God works things out??

how does Magna-TronX sound???


heads up guys n gals, when I get this going and proven, I am going to build 20 units initially and would like firm orders with a small deposit, i am planning to make this a package deal on the first 20, after that I'm not sure on the availability of the 411's. the package deal should be A 411 if needed ( reduced cost if you have one already or I cant source them), my Magna-Tronix distributor with a modded pigtail - (plug right into your existing opti wiring harnes), repining spread sheet for the 411, a sealed amplifier to mount on the fender or?? close to the ECU with wiring instructions. the 411 will not have a tune for your setup. I am hopping that the high voltage section will be viable item so that you don't have to go to CNP unless you wish.

[Tinbender59]

today I picked up the last (I hope) of the electronics parts, now to get it built and installed. I'm getting pumped now!! the reason this is so slow - I have Honeydoos, and i am trying to salvage an abused horse for a 13 year old girl. no she did not abuse the horse, it was bought that way. I am spending 30 min to 2 hours a day, trying to gain his trust, it is slow but rewarding. I hope to spend a good part of saturday workin on getting this assembled. I keep you all posted.

[popo8]

Fastbird (the opti mod)

LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[Tinbender59]

@Fastbird (http://ltxtech.com/forums/member.php?u=2) (the opti mod)

huh???! I don't get it :hmm:

[popo8]

I tagged fastbird in this thread since in the other thread he was confused at ur "opti mod" comment... hensce why it says Fastbird...

LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[Tinbender59]

ah cool thanks trying to get this finished, time is not my friend. lol

[Tinbender59]

The first design amplifier is built, MagnaTronX is built,, now to get it installed, hopefully by the end of the month

[TSAEB]

dont know why but im reading this post and the one on ls1tech lol. Cant wait to see the results.

[94Blackbird]

How about just " MAG ?"



LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

That's already a slang term for the Magnetos used in alcohol and fuel engines.

[popo8]

It can still be used tho.

LTXtech.com is my DRUG!

[Tinbender59]

thanks 94blackbird, I havent had a good laugh in a while but the corps??? the NAVY aint far behind

"Only in the Corps can you put three guys in a room with an anvil and a rubber mallet, come back 15 min later, and the anvil is broken, the rubber mallet is missing, and nobody saw a damned thing!"
I love it!!!!

[Tinbender59]

Hay guys I've been doing some forward thinking. to come up with a fair price, I need input on something. Do I include a cap and rotor?? If I do, I have a personel conviction; If I wont use, it I wont sell it. in otherwords I will only include top quality parts, and they are not cheap $$$. Delphi, AC Delco, Bosh, .... when I get to the point that I have a large numbers of orders I should be able to lean on the supplier for better prices?? INPUT PLEASE!!!

[superspirit]

I would check with your supplier to see what kind of break you can get with a quantity purchase, if you cant get a break where you can make a profit. I wouldnt mess with it. let everyone get the cap and rotor of their choice.

[firebird_1995]

Don't do it Lloyd. I'm in a similar situation with my spacers and their pricing/parts offerings. As a consumer, I prefer to pay "more" for a setup so I know that I have a matched set of the hardware/gaskets the manufacturer designed the product for, not necessarily what the hardware store or parts store had on sale that week.
Well, that stuff isnt free for us so we have to charge more for it. Aside from a few people in support of the idea, all I'm hearing on lstech and cz28 is my price is too high. Well, the only way to get it lower is to
A) buy your raw materials in bulk. (and hope like hell it all sells to pass on what, an additional 10% savings.... maybe?)
B) offer ONLY the parts they can't buy off the shelves and let them chase down the gaskets and bolts (cap and rotor in your case).
C) Take a reduction in profit. This one is hard to do when by the time you pay all the people for their part in the project, you're left with less than 10% of your selling price. And that's before you pay to ship it.....


I guarantee they are not taking into consideration the gas money to the parts store, only to be greeted with "well we don't carry that brand/model but we can order it" and having to make a run to the parts store at 10 minutes till quitting time to try and finish up the project....ehhh. Maybe I'm not the best to be taking advice from. I'm just a little chapped with the opinions I've received concerning pricing on other sites. (See option C) Oh well, it serves a purpose for us and a few others. That's good enough I guess!

I think you need to sell them the part they can't buy off the shelf.... the distributor, the modified PCM and/or wiring, and call it done.

[Tinbender59]

Don't do it Lloyd. I'm in a similar situation with my spacers and their pricing/parts offerings. As a consumer, I prefer to pay "more" for a setup so I know that I have a matched set of the hardware/gaskets the manufacturer designed the product for, not necessarily what the hardware store or parts store had on sale that week.
Well, that stuff isnt free for us so we have to charge more for it. Aside from a few people in support of the idea, all I'm hearing on lstech and cz28 is my price is too high. Well, the only way to get it lower is to
A) buy your raw materials in bulk. (and hope like hell it all sells to pass on what, an additional 10% savings.... maybe?)
B) offer ONLY the parts they can't buy off the shelves and let them chase down the gaskets and bolts (cap and rotor in your case).
C) Take a reduction in profit. This one is hard to do when by the time you pay all the people for their part in the project, you're left with less than 10% of your selling price. And that's before you pay to ship it.....


I guarantee they are not taking into consideration the gas money to the parts store, only to be greeted with "well we don't carry that brand/model but we can order it" and having to make a run to the parts store at 10 minutes till quitting time to try and finish up the project....ehhh. Maybe I'm not the best to be taking advice from. I'm just a little chapped with the opinions I've received concerning pricing on other sites. (See option C) Oh well, it serves a purpose for us and a few others. That's good enough I guess!

I think you need to sell them the part they can't buy off the shelf.... the distributor, the modified PCM and/or wiring, and call it done.


ya Ive seen those posts, and I feel your pain, and you are probably spot on???

[Sahara54]

Sorry to shoot off topic a bit and go back a few posts but it's hard to put out great and innovative products for our platform due to our main demographic. Most of us on this site have these cars because we like the LT1 and are willing to spend money on decent parts to keep them running or make that easier. Most of the ones on the other site or FB don't want to spend money but still complain when the car breaks after using inferior eBay crap. I agree with Chris, sell them the custom parts and part numbers for everything else.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Tinbender59]

DONE!!!! also a quick note, I found my test lab from Tech school, and It still works, has 5 / 12 vdc outputs, a signal generator, and LED's for indicators!! I'll be able to simulate a running motor to test the amplifier, and test the New sensor in my MagnaTronX distributor, before It goes in the truck. Which will be nice to know that It does work on the benchso tha I have a known good setup, and if there are problems, the modded system is ruled out :claps::thumbsup:

[Tinbender59]

today I fired up the test lab, and .... the amplifier works like a champ, but the sensor in the distributor is not working, may be me???? maybe that the test lab puts out only 500mili amps of power??? or I havent figured out how to connect it up yet?? but at least I can test it befor It is in the hole!!! to find this out now. stay tuned, I have not said "die" yet!!!!


EDIT: after some resarch!!! I R Smart!!!! I forgot that it is either a sink or a source system --- IE: I need a pull down resistor or a pull up resistor. But it could be a "basic Hall Effect" sensor, which will need a more complicated circuit than I have to interpret the signal. hum!! more testing to do

[Tinbender59]

hay guy's sorry about the long time no post, this is a busy month, weddings, graduations ..bla bla bla.. I will be back on this soon!!!! please be patient tinman

[superspirit]

Well life does get in the way doesnt it. glad to hear you havent fallen off the end of the earth. lookin forward to updates.

[Tinbender59]

Today, trying to make progress, so I was looking up the wires that I needed to "interrupt" to switch between the two distributors; Vortec / MagnaTronX. Could not find the supply voltage coming out of the ECU; (blind) or Divine intervention? Anyway ended up looking at the 2002 van schematics, and to my surprise, it had the internal drawing of the cam sensor with values on the resistors??? That is crazy!!! I’ll do the math, and verify it on the 411 inputs on my truck –but I think that the cam signal “IS” a 5vdc input. If you remember my replacement sensor is 5vdc as well?? . you guys probably think I’m a retard lol but my mind is always churning out theories, Ideas, and data that I have to investigate, when I’m on a project. The LT install took 3 motors and a year total to get worked out to where it is now. I’m kind of anal about getting it right and don’t like to say quit!!

[Tinbender59]

hay all, today I ordered my EFI Live, and WB O2 sensor, will order valve springs soon, then should be able to rip the motor down, and set it up for testing. hopefully?? in 2 weeks. my next weekend off!! I am looking forward to proving my theories. or my insanity lol

[firebird_1995]

Lloyd, I should have those spacers to you soon

[Tinbender59]

thanks Chris, my Wide Band O2 showed up today, EFI should show Wednesday :claps: :claps: getting everything in place to get down and dirty. lol should have a working prototype in less than 30 days, if all goes as planned, :drool::drool:

[Tinbender59]

I have 1 4l60e to rebuild then Im back on the MagnaTronX, hope to be installing it in 2 weeks! sorry for the delays but life does happen.

[Tinbender59]

Hay Guys, sorry for the long sabatical, have had some serious family issues, and they drove me to a couple of stress/anxiety attacks. I thought that the 2nd one was a full blown heart attack, actually don't know yet?? I had to deal with, and make arangements to get the situation some help. I hope to be back on this project real soon. I havent given up on it yet, so dont you guys give up either. I will do my best figure it out.

[superspirit]

Well take care of your health and family first.but I would like to see this come to fruition as I am doing another opti now.

[Tinbender59]

Well take care of your health and family first.but I would like to see this come to fruition as I am doing another opti now.

I'm sorry man I had hoped to be in full production by now, and moving on to the next project, but CACA do happen!!!

[Tinbender59]

well Dangit, this 4L60E is kicking my arse, as soon as I get rid of it I will get back on this project, I Promise!!! if It doesn't cooperate soon It is going to a professional shop, Like after I recheck the valve body!!!!


P.S. I got the all clear from the Heart Doc. whew that is a load off my "chest" LOL!!!

[superspirit]

Well glad to hear the Doc says all is well. good luck on the trans.

[Tinbender59]

thanks. Superspirit, kind of excited to get back to work on my ideas. Plus I have a small problem - it is called Money, lol!! I recieved a call this morning, about a 93 or 94 Bird with an LT1, interior and wiring has been swapped to 1995 pieces, and asking $1900 OBO. I have been putting the word out that I was looking for an ElCamino for a test platform. I want to push my motor theory to the limits, my 4x4 truck gets 23mpg on the highway on cruse. what could a sleak, light, and low vehicle do with that setup??? so now to make a desicion???

[Tinbender59]

Today worked on the distributor, another couple of hours It will be ready to install. I have my cam, replacement Intake, Valve springs, 36lb injectors, Water pump extenders and drive, EFILive ready to start data loging. need to order Brass bolts to plug the Original LT manifold bolt holes.planning to start either, 8/11/14 or 8/18/14 depends on the 4L60E owners pockets.

[superspirit]

This is good news, The used opti I put in 150 miles ago is acting up, thats 2 opti's in 400 miles. I got to get rid of the opti!

[Tinbender59]

pm me i'll send you my address, then you can get the jump on this. send me your bad opti!!

[superspirit]

PM sent.

[Tinbender59]

FINALY got rid ot the POS that was killing me, it had a broken reverse piston, a hairline crack. Son Of A Gun!!! 3 months 4 teardowns and $1000 to a "trans shop" to find it!!!!! but it is gone. will be on the LT1 project ASAP I promise!!

[superspirit]

Well, thats good news on both counts. except for the tranny shop bill.

[firebird_1995]

Get it done man I can't wait to see it work

[Tinbender59]

curent plan is to start teardown on the truck this Friday/Saturday. I have several updates/mods/repairs to get done as well. should be field testing within 2 to 4 weeks.

If I havent posted earler, the prototype is built, signals worked out, ready to mod the truck for quick distributor switch over (incase of an unforseen failure) I am anticipating a couple of issues due to unknown parameters. otherwise hopeing for smooth sailing.

[superspirit]

Awesome news, lookin forward to the results.

[Tinbender59]

ok Guys the wait is almost over! the truck went down Saturday, "2nd time in a week" same scenerio, tach dropped to "0", motor shut down, and we were coasting. last time it was a bad amplifier. I questioned the coil last time as well, this time it will get changed for sure. I have seen this a lot with bad plug wires, mine are Taylor spiral wound, so they should be good, but I will check them to!

I will start the teardown wednesday, hopefully be up and running in 10 days. stay tuned, the adventure is about to start.__________________

[superspirit]

Best of luck!

[Tinbender59]

today backed the truck into position in http://ltxtech.com/forums/asset.php?fid=22054&uid=6810&d=1392410822the shop to begin work tomorrow. :claps::claps:

[Ccreddell]

Well, that answers one question. Now we know where all bugs go to die....

[Tinbender59]

Well, that answers one question. Now we know where all bugs go to die....


Hasgroppers are bad this year!!

[Ccreddell]

Looks like a plague of Biblical proportions!!!

[Tinbender59]

the motor Is almost a bare long block, after I get it cleaned and resealed up I will start back together. I'll try to post pictures from my smart phone. if not later then

[Tinbender59]

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/10/07/5f7f8cab20e33559101f18dd6701b8fb.jpg

Current stat of affairs

[Tinbender59]

the motor is down to a long block, I will be putting an LT4 hot cam in then back together it goes, MagnaTronX is assembled (I will be testing functionality tonight, and post results) Hope to have it back up and running By 11/2/14 On the MagnaTronX. Waa Hoo

[superspirit]

this is awesome, waiting for the results.:cheers:

[Tinbender59]

Here is a picture of the motor, and truck tore down, Im headed out to test the MagnaTronX Now!! Ill be back

[Tinbender59]

IT WORKS!!!! https://www.flickr.com/photos/tinbender59/15427254347/ the 12vdc light flashes on and off!! next is to get it mounted and check the timming

[Ccreddell]

http://ltxtech.com/forums/showthread.php?27709-MagnaTronX-Install-and-Field-Testing