Fully Adjustable Tubular A-Arms, LCA's, Panhard Bar, Torque Arm, etc. on Street Car?

[93formulalt1]

Hey guys, I have a couple questions. . .

I got a SMOKIN' deal on some used suspension parts last year (used less than 5k miles, look like new), and was wondering if they may be a bit too "extreme" for a street car/Summer DD.

Here's what I have:
UMI Tubular Adjustable Torque Arm and Mount w/ Driveshaft Safety Loop
UMI Adjustable Panhard Bar
Rear LCA's (Not sure if adjustable or not, and can't remember what brand off top of head)
BMR Front Upper and Lower Adjustable A-Arms
Spohn Strut Tower Brace
KYB AGX Adjustable Shocks (have one pair already, going to order matching shocks for rear, I think it's the fronts I already have)
Eibach Sportline Coils (have maybe 50k miles on them)
Replacement Strut Mounts for front (I think they are MOOG brand, but couldn't say for certain)

I still need rear LCA relocation brackets, and I'd like to get some SFC's, but I was wondering if what I've listed so far may be a bit too extreme for a car that is going to be a mostly street-driven car. I want a car that's fun to drive, I'd like to take it to the strip once, just to see what it's capable of, and I'd like to try out autocross once or twice, but for the most part, it's going to be a fun weekend cruiser/summer DD. All of the front control arms have Heim joints, I've heard they transmit more road noise than a stock or non-adjustable control arm will, but that's not a concern, really. I'm planning to lower the car with the Eibach springs, use the KYB AGX shocks front and rear, and put some decent tires on it (probably going with 275/40/ZR17). I am planning to do all of the suspension work, as well as brake pads and rotors, at the same time, over a weekend, then take it to a shop in Brighton to have a 4-wheel alignment done (I've been referred to this shop because they specialize in performance cars, and I've been told they can fine-tune the suspension, rather than pulling numbers out of a book like most shops do)

As far as ride quality, I don't mind a harsh ride, as my commute to/from work is maybe 5 miles each way, and I can change my route to avoid the rougher roads if needed. I make a drive across the state (about 360 miles round-trip) twice a month, and this car would be making the trek, so highway manners are a priority, but I know that with 275's on all four corners, it's not going to drive like a Cadillac, it's going to want to follow the ruts in the road, and I'm fine with that.

I want a noticeable improvement in handling, I want it to drive like a finely-tuned performance car, and I'd like to out-handle just about anything else on the road. We know these cars aren't necessarily known for how well they handle from the factory, I'd like to surprise some people. Do I have a decent setup accumulated to accomplish that? Is there anything on my list that you would do differently? Anything I should pick up to replace at the same time?


Mostly looking for input from the folks who may know this stuff better than I do. This is most of what I have in my "Parts Pile", and I really want to make some forward progress on my car (after I get the engine issues straightened out this weekend). I will be installing a Stage 3 Competition Clutch in the car at some point this summer as well, and I intend to install a poly trans mount at the same time. I would do poly engine mounts as well, but I'm going to hold off for a little while (I remember how much of a PITA those suckers are).




Sorry for writing a book, just excited to finally be ready to make progress, and I'd like some opinions/suggestions to avoid making stupid mistakes. Thanks in advance!

[96LT1355Z28]

There are lots of cars driving on the street with setups just like what you have. As for if it's "too extreme" for the street I say no but that's an opinion. It's going to depend on what you consider extreme. It's going to ride a little stiffer and your going to have some more road noise. It's street ability can really only be determined by you! I think most people are gonna say you'll be fine as long as you expect to hear some more road noise ans a stiffer ride. FWIW I have MWC rod ended LCA's, PHB, chassis mounted TA, CE SFC's, BMR Xtreme drag bar, and an AKE K member with UMI rod ended lower A arms.

[MeanTA]

^^^^ He is right. I run rod ends on my car. You will get more road noise. But is streetable just don't go in expecting a new caddy feel. And you will be fine.

[dzltek]

too extreme, you could just pass that great deal on to another member.........say......like........ME!!!! LOL

[93formulalt1]

I did some research last night, most of what I've read say that I'll likely have to replace the rod ends every few years, but aside from that (and a slightly harsher ride), there shouldn't be any adverse side effects.

I'm excited to get this part of my project going, I just need to get the LCA relocation brackets, a pair of rear shocks, and replace a grease fitting that's broken off (don't ask how that happened, I got these used) in one of the front A-Arms, and I'll be ready to go. I will post pics before/after, as I'm sure the stance is going to change pretty dramatically, as will the handling.

I'm thinking I'll tackle this project toward the end of June or July, time permitting.

[Tbird232ci]

The only red flag I see with your parts pile is the Sportline springs. They are too soft for how low they are, and you'll be all over your bump stops. I don't know what your budget is like, but I'd highly suggest BMR springs, if not those, Hotchkis or another higher name brand. The Eibach springs, Sportline and Prokits, are known to sag.

You'll be fine with everything else. Do it all in one shot, and it'll feel like a different car.

[v7guy]

I'm pretty leary of the tubular a arms. Myself and a good number of others have bent the shock mount. BMR had told me to bend it back and put an aluminum piece they would sell me to strengthen it. I wasn't real keen on the idea and the guys on frrax agreed (bunch of engineer type fellas). I ended up converting a pair of stock arms to spherical bearings since I kept splitting the poly ones.

I would also stay away from the sportlines just cause they are awfully soft.

The rest sounds pretty alright.


To be honest I saw the biggest improvements in handling with some big ole sway bars (35mm front 1"rear) and lowering the PHR and leveling the LCAs with some good shocks. I'm running some bilstein racing coilovers, but a lot of guys seem to be pretty happy with the koni's. I haven't really kept up with what kyb is doing but last I knew they were mostly a drag shock.

You kinda gotta figure out how far down this "handling" road you want to go. These cars can corner pretty damn well with the proper upgrades, but you give up a good bit at the strip doing so.

I don't think rod ends are too extreme for the street, but like mentioned, it's just an opinion

[MeanTA]

I wouldnt worry about the a arms myself. Ive never bent one. The ones ive seen bent. Was after some pretty crazy accidents or shock.

I run the 1 inch lowering BMR a arm. With the way the arm is designed and the stick mount lower. I can't imagine it ever bending on me.

[Homerandabe69]

I talked to Strano about the tubular vs. boxed lower A-arms and he said that with any sort of road course work the boxed are definitely recommended. The tubular are made more as a weight reduction and can't handle the stress of hard cornering. Great for drag racing though.

[v7guy]

1987219873


This was after about 6500 miles, all on the street doing daily driver duties. No running over curbs, no big potholes, nothing other than driving around on nice roads down in TX. I'm not being doom and gloom saying the car will fall apart and kittens and puppies are gonna die, just that you should be very aware of the possibility and check them regularly if you have a similar style mount. This made me leary enough that I wouldn't run a similar design. The boxed do look better, but the small tube mount still seems a bit sketchy.
To BMRs credit they actually offered the spacers free of charge.

If you want to read the old thread and are a member on frrax you can read about it here...

[v7guy]

Forgot to add the link and having trouble editing my post, apologies

http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/index.php?showtopic=11337&hl=

[MeanTA]

Ouch that sucks! Maybe this is because of a old design. Or because yours are a different arm then mine.

But my shock mount is thicker. And don't stand off the arm as much as yours. Mine also has a folded lip on the open sides to add support. It was a pain to get the bolts started. With the tight space.

I autox/ road course my car. And have hit somethings that jolted the whole car. But after almost 2 years there doing good.

[Injuneer]

I'm not too sure who's design this lower a-arm is, but the shock mounting is a lot more substantial. The K-member is PA Racing, just not sure about the a-arm. This car was dropped hard several times from way-too-big wheel stands. The a-arms survived, the K-member needed a weld repaired an some reinforcement added.

[93formulalt1]

The posts mentioning bent shock mounts have me concerned, since my A-Arms have the "weaker" looking design, and I really would rather have something a little more substantial than that, given the fact that it's not even enough for 6.5k of DD use. . . The roads where I live are mediocre at best, some of them are downright abominable.

What about everything (except front A-Arms) mentioned above, with stock control arms and MOOG bushings? A better compromise to improve handling and maintain strength?

At this point, I'm looking at different shocks and springs also. If nothing else, I may consider selling the A-Arms, front shocks (KYB AGX, new in boxes), mounting the torque arm, rear LCA's and Relo's, replacing the bushings on the front a-arms, and going with BMR springs and Koni shocks all around. Not looking for a "slammed" look, but I definitely want it lower than stock. I just bought new tires for all 4 corners, and I'd like to do the suspension upgrades, have the tires mounted, and have it all aligned at once.

I'm also planning on either the LS1 steering shaft or rag joint eliminator, and some brake upgrades (contemplating the C5 Z06 calipers/rotors w/ stainless braided brake lines in front, and LS1 rear brake swap), but this is all going to be an "as I can afford parts" build, where I buy one or two pieces as I have the funds available, and install the whole kit when the parts are all on hand. Selling the a-arms and shocks should help things a bit, as I know those should still fetch decent prices.

Any suggestions? The car is a summer Daily Driver, but I want it to be able to handle and stop better than stock. These brakes are underpowered, the suspension is getting old (19 years old, 162k miles), and driving the car just doesn't feel as "tight" as it should. I know new bushings will help a lot, but I wonder if I'm leaving something on the table by sticking with stock a-arms rather than boxed aftermarket units.

[OVA1]

I'm on a full BMR Front end…2108621092 with Hochkis out back.

If it helps, my street-ish car works fine with the High Performance Suspension.

[93formulalt1]

I'm on a full BMR Front end…2108621087 Hochkis out back. But these are the only photos I had hoped that they showed the A-arms better.

But if it helps, my street-ish car works fine with the High Performance Suspension.
How long have you had all of that? Have you had any issues with bending the shock mounts on the lower arms? I just got my LCA relocation brackets, I still need tires, a clutch, and shocks/coils for all four corners before I'm ready to install any of it, but I'm getting there.

[OVA1]

I've had a tubular K-Member for years, added the A-Arms a year or two back, then a crazy woman, armed with a Mercury POS, ambushed me and bent everything except the K-member, which came out completely unscathed.

But beyond that, no issues with shock mounts.

[QC97Z]

OP, I've got a lot of the same stuff you do, minus the A-arms and the Eibach springs. Mine was built as a street car that may see the strip every once in a great while.

My setup:

KYB AGX adjustables on front and rear
stock springs front and rear
stock front a-arms
Spohn sway bars front and rear with poly bushings on links
UMI tubular adjustable torque arm with driveshaft loop
UMI on-car adjustable panhard
UMI non-adjustable LCA's
UMI tubular bolt-in SFC's.

Loving the performance, have no issues - I tool around town in mine, but have also been on some extensive (400+ mile) trips with it.
The only thing I can complain about is my possibly out-of-balance driveshaft lol

[SSlowBoat]

ive been running:

umi tubular poly/rod front lower arms
bmr chromoly adjustable full length torque arm
founders poly/rod lca's
founders rod/rod panhard
slp bilsteins
bmr rear/hotchkis front springs

way better than stock. hardest part was the alignment because i had no front arm to reference (had to cut off caster part of arms to remove stockers). i daily my car up and down my washed out stone driveway, in northern nj/eastern pa on bumpy back roads etc for almost a year and have no issues. i have to order umi upper arms still. no bending, no cracking, no creaking, etc. most i have is on hard launch with a full tank of gas and a full hatch of groceries my torque arm hits a little, since the rear mount is alot larger than stock. drive it to the shore 2hrs no problem. to dyno day 1.5 hours no problem. actually just got back from getting formula for my kid.

my father inlaws' 94 is bone stock suspension. mine feels 10x times safer, waaay more predictable and stable.
No issues with shock mounts I've smacked some bumps and rather large jersey style HOLES harder than you can ever imagine, and came out unscathed. UMI really beefed up the shock mount.

[SSlowBoat]

93formulalt1 if anything i would suggest is different better springs and shocks. id put everything else on. when i talked to strano he said do you live anywhere with kinda bumpy roads, i said yeah, he said you will need new shocks in a year with kyb's. the rates on the eibachs are low as well. slp bilsteins feel like konis on full soft, they ride nice and firm up when you need em to. cheap as well. UMI told me if i break/crack/bend their arms, they will replace them for pretty much free. says alot about the faith in their product. the scca autocross cp class northeast regional champ ran umi uppers/lowers, and daylied his car while also driving it to the course 2.5 hours from him. never had a problem.

tubular front a arms made the biggest difference in my case. steering response is amazing. the ability to dial in the alignment i wanted for handling was key to me buying them, and if you have the original caster bushing good luck getting it off. mine was shot and when i hit bumps the car pulled hard one way.

my stance:
22612

[FASHOOTER]

I have full UMI front set up never had any issues

[Flyinz]

TTT. Whats the easiest way to replace the upper control arm w/balljoint? Can I just unbolt the top/bottom of the strut, and bring the strut/spring/upper control arm out, as one piece? Then I can just swap the control arm out in the open?

[dawdaw]

I would just disconnect the spindle from the upper control and replace it... pretty straight forward, I don't see any need to take the shock out

[Flyinz]

The reason I mention that is, b/c on the rear control arm bolt, you can't access that bolt/nut, b/c the coil spring is in the way. You can't get a wrench on it.

[dawdaw]

For some odd reason I thought you were trying to replace just the ball joint.... pull the tire off, disconnect the upper shock mount from the tower brace (the thing the upper arm bolts to, swing it out and disconnect the spindle from the upper control arm and remove the shock from the lower control arm and it'll come out as one piece... the upper control arm shock mount is a bastard to get the 2 bolts out of it that attaches it to the upper control arm, at least mine were...

Take your new upper control arms and attach them to the shock mount, and put your shock back in... this isn't the fastest way to do it but Its at least you van swing the assembly out and is a heck of a lot easier to work in in my opinion...

What shocks are you using? The ones that have the hats with 4 bolts in them ( factory style)

[Flyinz]

Thats what I thought about doing, but I wasn't sure if that would work or not. Im running the QA1 r series, factory style.

[dawdaw]

Do it boss! U can kick me in the nuts if it doesn't work

[Flyinz]

Well, I got the pass. side done, it wasn't too bad. But how do you know who long, to adjust the rod ends out, on the upper control arm?

[dawdaw]

Take it to get aligned.. I'm no suspension guru on caster camber toe... for sure go get it aligned

[Flyinz]

Yea, I planned on that. But I wasn't sure if I had to adjust them to a certain spec, before install. We have an alignment rack at work, I'll just have my boss line it back up :), Thanks!

[SSlowBoat]

Yea, I planned on that. But I wasn't sure if I had to adjust them to a certain spec, before install. We have an alignment rack at work, I'll just have my boss line it back up :), Thanks!

What are your plans for the car? There is a chart that has recommended alignment specs for these cars based on the driving you do. Stock settings kinda suck if you like turning.

chart: http://www.angelfire.com/my/fastcar/suspension.html

[Tbird232ci]

UMI says that they ship their control arms adjusted to the factory specs.

[SSlowBoat]

UMI says that they ship their control arms adjusted to the factory specs.

with loose jam nuts. we just put umi lca's, panhard, and torque arm on the heads cam car. all the jam nuts were loose and the arms were different lengths. double check them, and dont forget the threadlocker