Anyone tried a Ford 8.8 rear in an F-body?

[mpe331lx]

Like everyone with a stock reared F-Body, I am in desperate need of a stout rear end in Stephs 97. I really dont want to go with a 9" due to how heavy it is and how much power is liost with it. The dana S60 is another option, but it also is pretty inefficient. I 12 bolt is out of the question with a 6 speed. I have personally seen three of them break at BMP.

I was pretty sure that I read somwhere taht the S60 had MORE loss than the 9" and I just found a post about GM HTP's article where they tested the S60, The 9" and the 10 bolt. The S60 had the most drivetrain loss!


the s 60 is bigger and alot heavier which means it will eat up lot more power as well.... GMHP had an article a while back comparing the s60 to a Moser M9 which is just fab 9 inch housing. But the s60 had 3.5% more drivetrain loss than a 10 bolt and the 9 inch had like 1-1.5%....


That leaves me with the 8.8. With a set of strange or Moser 31spl axles and a 31 spl trac loc diff out of a truck or an 03/04 Cobra, and welded axle tubes, it will take any abuse that I can throw at it.
The 8.8 is fairly lightweight (compared to the 9"), and is a very efficient rear end.

I have cut a 1.42 60 ft in my 96 Cobra and have went 9.93 @ 142. I am confedent that it would hold up to the AI383 on the spray.

About a year ago, I did quite a few searches on ls1 tech. Most that have tried had major issues with the torque arm. Everyone was welding mounts to the cast iron part of the housing for the OEM torque arm (or an upgraded OEM style unit). After a few hard launches or quite a bit of street driving the welded mounts would crack (unles cast iron is heated to a very high temp, and kept at that temp, it does not weld very well, even than, it is not that strong)

I have been trying to figure out why no one has tried to adapt a mustang specific torque arm to the car. It bolts directly to the rear and uses a crossmember that ties inbetween a set of subframe connectors just aft of the transmission. I am sure that the crossmember would either have to be modified or a custom one fabricated.

This is not somthing that just anyone can do, and would not be coast effective for somone to pay a shop to do. In the long run a 9" or an s60 would be cheaper or very close in price.
But for someone with welding and fabrication skills, it could probably be done for half the price of either of the bolt in rears.
I have seen used 8.8s that were built sell anywhere from $500-1300 (with $600 bieng the average price) depending on what was done to them . I am pretty sure the torque arm kit goes for around $350 new.


I am going to be doing some heavy research on the subject and will try and keep this updated. If anyone has any info or links on the subject, please post up.

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/985420-8-8-my-02-z28.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/181434-boom-bitch-8-8-broke-pics-inside-kinda-long-story.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/184734-heres-my-8-8-what-do-you-think-pics-2.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/lsx-parts-sale/285575-8-8-rear-sale.html

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=411252

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/showthread.php?t=434580

Pretty much the same info that I came up with last year, still no one has mentioned using a mustang specific torque arm....HMMMMMM

[joelster]

Like everyone with a stock reared F-Body, I am in desperate need of a stout rear end in Stephs 97. I really dont want to go with a 9" due to how heavy it is and how much power is liost with it. The dana S60 is another option, but it also is pretty inefficient. I 12 bolt is out of the question with a 6 speed. I have personally seen three of them break at BMP.

I was pretty sure that I read somwhere taht the S60 had MORE loss than the 9" and I just found a post about GM HTP's article where they tested the S60, The 9" and the 10 bolt. The S60 had the most drivetrain loss!




That leaves me with the 8.8. With a set of strange or Moser 31spl axles and a 31 spl trac loc diff out of a truck or an 03/04 Cobra, and welded axle tubes, it will take any abuse that I can throw at it.
The 8.8 is fairly lightweight (compared to the 9"), and is a very efficient rear end.

I have cut a 1.42 60 ft in my 96 Cobra and have went 9.93 @ 142. I am confedent that it would hold up to the AI383 on the spray.

About a year ago, I did quite a few searches on ls1 tech. Most that have tried had major issues with the torque arm. Everyone was welding mounts to the cast iron part of the housing for the OEM torque arm (or an upgraded OEM style unit). After a few hard launches or quite a bit of street driving the welded mounts would crack (unles cast iron is heated to a very high temp, and kept at that temp, it does not weld very well, even than, it is not that strong)

I have been trying to figure out why no one has tried to adapt a mustang specific torque arm to the car. It bolts directly to the rear and uses a crossmember that ties inbetween a set of subframe connectors just aft of the transmission. I am sure that the crossmember would either have to be modified or a custom one fabricated.

This is not somthing that just anyone can do, and would not be coast effective for somone to pay a shop to do. In the long run a 9" or an s60 would be cheaper or very close in price.
But for someone with welding and fabrication skills, it could probably be done for half the price of either of the bolt in rears.
I have seen used 8.8s that were built sell anywhere from $500-1300 (with $600 bieng the average price) depending on what was done to them . I am pretty sure the torque arm kit goes for around $350 new.


I am going to be doing some heavy research on the subject and will try and keep this updated. If anyone has any info or links on the subject, please post up.

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/985420-8-8-my-02-z28.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/181434-boom-bitch-8-8-broke-pics-inside-kinda-long-story.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/184734-heres-my-8-8-what-do-you-think-pics-2.html

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/lsx-parts-sale/285575-8-8-rear-sale.html

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=411252

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/showthread.php?t=434580

Pretty much the same info that I came up with last year, still no one has mentioned using a mustang specific torque arm....HMMMMMM

First of all, on the drivetrain loss, you have to compare apples to apples there. The S60 was running big 35 spline axles, and the 12-bolt was running smaller ones (33 or 30 don't remember exactly). You won't break a 9-inch or an S60, but you MAY still break a 12-bolt. The pinion angle on the S60 is the best, but the parts inside are MUCH larger/heavier.

You are 100% correct about using a Mustang specific torque arm. It will be MUCH easier to do so rather than trying to adapt a Camaro arm to the ford rear. You might want to get an adjustable one though incase it launches weird. FWIW, my Camaro torque arm was cut down about 1 1/2 feet in length and is attached to a custom crossmember. The car launches amazing, so a shorter arm can most definetly work.

[96lt1m6]

you should contact Lloyd Elliot @ Elliotsportworks. Lloyd has the 8.8 under his car. his 8.8 came from this car
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/features/0608htp_1995_pontiac_trans_am_feature/index.htmlt check out this TQ arm set up,of course it would need to be modified but still an option
http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/tech/mmfp_0812_1993_cobra_mustang_rear_suspension/engine_torque.html

[AChotrod]

Ive seen cars cut 1.4 60s with about 450 hp on a S60. Dont beleive what you read! Yes it is heavier but its also more efficient according to everything else Ive heard and its basicaly indestructable, and fits the best. Thats why I bought one for my car!

[96lt1m6]

nothing wrong with the s60 at all!!
i have seen 10-bolts 60' the same,how long will the 10-bolt do it, well:secret:
my list of choices being cheapest option on up to the $ options
8.8 rear
12-bolt
s60
9":shame:

[mpe331lx]

You won't break a 9-inch or an S60, but you MAY still break a 12-bolt.


That is why a 12 bolt is absolutely out of the question.


Ive seen cars cut 1.4 60s with about 450 hp on a S60. Dont beleive what you read! Yes it is heavier but its also more efficient according to everything else Ive heard and its basicaly indestructable, and fits the best. Thats why I bought one for my car!

Nothing aginst the s60, it will definately hold the power and 60ft great.

At this time, I'm not ready to drop that kind of coin at once on the rear end.

I am just trying to explore another option that has been out there, but has not been perfected yet.

I do know that the 8.8 is very efficient and very strong when set up right.


96lt1m6, the torque arm set up in the MM&FF article is one of the designs that I've looked at for the swap. Thier HP and torque ratings on the standard and heavy duty piece are what concerns me. It may be able to be beefed up and run a sperical bushing on the end with all grade 8 hardware and larger bolts to handle more torque.
That same company also manufactures a race torque arm, the site does not give any torque specs on that unit, I am going to call tham and see what is actually different and how much it will take.

[96lt1m6]

I agree with you. the design does concern me aswell. it does not look like it can withstand a copious amount of TQ especially with the u-bolt design.
I think that it would serve as a good reference for chromoly,spherical ends and weld on bracketry...
Did you email Lloyd Elliot about his set up that he got from Clint(T/ALt1) his car ran 9's with the 8.8 but i do not know how it was set up under the f-body....


as far as 12-bolts breaking-people do not pay the extra money for 33-spline axles and a REAL posi unit or spool...my friends TA has had a moser 12 bolt for 5 years hundreds of 1.30 60' times NO BREAKAGE!

[joelster]

I see you have some fabrication skills and aren't afraid to do some welding.

Why don't you head to your local bone-yard and dig out a Dana60 instead?

I see them all the time, under small school buses, F250's F350's, vans, etc..... Take a peek at the suspension setups on them and see how they are located. Maybe you could adapt them to the f-bod.

[Biggin'89]

12-bolts work great in 4-link setups. but these cars put a wicked amount of stress on the housing with the torque arm, which is why the 10-bolts get broken and 12-bolts get a terrible gear whine.

[BluBeaSSt]

Do it right the first time and Build a 9inch or S60, but unlike what has been said in this thread EVERY REAR END IS BREAKABLE!!! NOTHING IS BULLET PROOF!!!!!!!!


I have a Moser 9 inch and Love it, but I did lose a MPH. The good thing about the 9 is the Pinion support inside the casing,leaves less room for flex :D

[ksmyss]

i built my own 8.8 hybrid. i used the stock 10 bolt axles tubes and had collars machined to mate the 10 bolt tubes to the 8.8 tubes (they are slightly different sizes). i also put support bars across the top and bottom just to be safe. the ear on the side of the 8.8 pumkin had to be ground down and thats were i welded the torque arm mount to along with a few other small braces to make sure it wasn't going anywhere.

i was running the stock 10 bolt axles because i got a free 8.8 posi but the posi is toast so i have a set of 31 spline mosers and a 31 spline track loc waiting to go in if i ever get time to work on the rear section of the car.