First Real Build

**dawdaw** · 06-03-2016, 08:57 PM

Nah, I've seen a motor that gets street driven more then anyone on this site and has over 1100 passes on a set of 2618 diamonds .. I wouldn't second guess putting in a set.

4032 has its place in a mild engine, beyond that any serious boost or spray needs a 2618.

**kevloc77** · 06-03-2016, 09:28 PM

That's what I was to understand but again I'm still learning. I've got a lot to learn but I've always dreamed of having a car that can tear it up on and off the strip.

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**Catmaigne** · 06-03-2016, 09:49 PM

Well my brothers sisters uncles dogs ex roommates car had em and they didn't even last the trip to mcdonalds and back.

The metallurgy doesn't lie. 2618 has a fraction of the silicon content which makes it more ductile. That's great for detonation resistance but awful for longevity which is exactly why OEMs don't use it. The LS9, new LT4, GT500, Hellcat, etc are all using 4032 Mahles. The LSA from the CTSV and ZL1 aren't even forged.

Reciprocating motion with drag from the rings is going to widen the ring grooves and compression will be lost over time. Pulling apart a shortblock every 50k or so for new pistons/rings sounds very not fun.

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**Injuneer** · 06-03-2016, 10:08 PM

My skirts are Swain moly coated. I daily drove the car 9 months a year for 2 years when the engine was first built. Unfortunately the engine has more engine dyno and chassis dyno pulls on it than passes at the track.

**dawdaw** · 06-04-2016, 09:03 AM

ncles dogs ex roommates car had em and they didn't even last the trip to mcdonalds and back.

The metallurgy doesn't lie. 2618 has a fraction of the silicon content which makes it more ductile. That's great for detonation resistance but awful for longevity which is exactly why OEMs don't use it. The LS9, new LT4, GT500, Hellcat, etc are all using 4032 Mahles. The LSA from the CTSV and ZL1 aren't even forged.

Reciprocating motion with drag from the rings is going to widen the ring grooves and compression will be lost over time. Pulling apart a shortblock every 50k or so for new pistons/rings sounds very not fun.

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You are a complete fuckin moron. All you do is read shit on the internet And it is quite apparent by reading all the garbage that you post about and put it on your build thread , like you have a clue

Why don't you get back to building your car that has next to no miles on it and let us know when it has 50000 on it And it's as healthy as an ox because it has 4032 alloy pistons in it instead of 2618

No one is denying the fact of the longevity issue of a 2618 vs a4 032. But honestly how many people do you know of that have rebuilt forged short blocks that are knocking down 50,000 miles that are spraying 2 - 300 shots? That's right none

Everything that gets put into a motor should be built around what your purpose is and what you want to do with it. If you want to have a docile Street engine that has a small blower or a little shot and you want to get Max longevity out of it yes I could see using a 4032 piston but when you're talking about knocking down 300 horse worth of spray good luck keeping it together for any amount of time with a 4032 in it.

**SSlowBoat** · 06-04-2016, 11:51 AM

Karl ellwein recommended 4032 wisecos for boost up to 800whp on a car that only sees street and maybe track once in a while, if that says anything. I suggested the 2618, and wiseco said you really don't need it, with the way stuff is made now a days 4032 is plenty

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**Catmaigne** · 06-04-2016, 04:25 PM

I asked those sort of questions to Karl Ellwein and Kurt Urban when I wanted to get into the tech side of things, but apparently listening to real engine builders and doing a little research makes me a complete fuckin moron. So basically what I ought to be doing is listening to some rando on the internet get on his soap box about a friend of a friend of a friend's motor that allegedly gets driven like a Corolla, even with the wrong parts. I am not against 2618, but something like that has its place. I see there are many on the forums that are too quick to recommend over the top shit for even the most mild of builds which is why I brought it up in the first place, no need to get your panties in a wad. People have put up to a 200 shot on stock bottom ends and lived to tell, so you mean to tell me a decent 4032 forged slug isn't going to get the job done? BS. So far we know that OP wants 2-300 worth of spray, car is mostly drag, but dreams of a car that could last on the street too and I think it's doable.

**firebird_1995** · 06-04-2016, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by kevloc77

The cat will see minimal street time. Maybe some car meets but I am looking at mostly strip car.

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First off, welcome to the site. I'm sorry this thread had turned in to a pissing match. Here are my 2 pennies...

I don't have any experience with nitrous on my own cars but I've ran 4032 alloy pistons (srp brand -31cc,) on boosted setups and I will never do it again. Even with a spot on tune, pump gas and e85, I found myself on the phone with je/srp with 5 cracked pistons from 2 different engine builders that all had the same failure. They told me their srp line 4032 alloy was only recommended for less than 15# of boost or 750 crank horsepower. If you look at a lot of piston manufacturers or even engine builders that advertise rated horsepower levels you will find that above this level they start going to a 2618 alloy. The fact that a factory coyote, ls7, m3, ctsv, etc runs a 4032 is irrelevant in my opinion because there are other forces at work that determine how much a component can withstand before failure. These include rotating mass, pin height (which many times determines ring stack up, ring land thickness, and crown thickness), shape of the chamber, valve angle, even ignition timing.

Could you get away with a 4032 under a 200 shot? Probably. Under 300? Maybe, but that tune better be spot on. My point is, when a guy says he is "Looking at (building) mostly a strip car." and said car is looking to spray a 200-300 shot, I'm going to suggest a 2618 alloy piston, every time, because it is the best option given the confines of the build.

**kevloc77** · 06-07-2016, 09:22 AM

So I ended up with some 6.125 Scat H-beam rods. With that, I am sticking with a 355 build completely forged. My next question is, in order to get the compression where I need it (Im thinking around 12:1) what is the thickest head gasket you guys have ever used? If my deck on the block is good and we can leave .020 above the piston, I will need a .060 head gasket to get right at 12:1. Of course all these numbers might swing a bit once we do a mock up. what do you guys think?

**kevloc77** · 06-07-2016, 09:39 AM

I also ordered the rear main seal adapter for the crank. I hope it doesn't leak too bad. Now to order rings... What would be a good set of rings to use? 1/16 - 1/16 - 3/16?